“recent decades” meaning 1924?

Which of the commenters here said there was no danger?

Are you seriously claiming that soft/blue cheeses outsell cheddar etc?

The statement made above about 99% of cheese being pasteurised is very incorrect.
A bulk of cheeses are made by culturing with bacteria ie Blue Veined cheeses and ‘runny’ cheeses.

Rule of Thumb, most Processed cheese and a large quantity of hard cheeses are safe to eat, if in doubt… don’t eat it and check it out first.

There’s HUGE danger in saying ‘it’ll be fine’ and there’s _NO_ danger in just having something else.

http://www.foodstandards.gov.au/newsroom/factsheets/factsheets2005/listeriacommonlyaske3115.cfm

Up until recently the Australian drinking during pregnancy guidelines have been 7 standard drinks per week and no more than 2 in any one day. Much debate has recently seen a few health and paediatric bodies recommend zero alcohol during pregnancy and there doesn’t currently seem to be a single, ‘official’ type recommendation in this country.

also, in the US the general rule of thumb is to avoid wine, although i have heard that in italy (my husband is from there) and denmark (best friend is danish) it is allowed. my ob/gyn knowing that my husband and I spend about equal amts of time in the US and Italy OK’ed wine post 1st trimester – but one glass or less a day.

I would love to hear what the Aussie docs have to say on this. And ohers.

I still find it amazing how there is so little ‘definitive’ information on what is/isn’t safe to eat during pregnancy in terms of listeria infection. This is my second pregnancy and basically I am only eating hard, not smoked, cheeses and avoiding anything ‘fresh’ from a deli or sandwhich bar that may have become contaminated through the use of utensils, cutting boards, cling film, open refrigeration etc. I’m also again avoiding all raw seafoods (sob sob on the sushi front). I’m being extra careful with washing uncooked fruit and vegies that may have been in direct contact with soil (which listeria can live in) and particularly careful in visiting/drinking from fresh juice bars, as sometimes these places don’t wash their carrots/beetroots etc. Plus all the added food poisoning sources like soft serve icecream, partially cooked chicken, food from a bain marie and the list just continues.

I live in Australia which doesn’t allow the sale of unpasteurised dairy products and has only recently allowed the import of cured meats such as prosciuto, which a proportion of don’t pass customs due to listeria infection as has been recently reported.

I just find it amazing that there isn’t any definitive information on what foods are listeria risks and a list of all foods that should be avoided during pregnancy due to nitrates (smoked foods) mercury (top of the food chain fish) salmonella (raw egg yolks) and I’m sure the list goes on and on and on. I can only guess that people and health departments are fearful of litigation if they were to publish a definitive list.

And here endeth my rant.

listeria tends to grow on foods that are covered in a white rind – most salamis, several cheeses. so when in doubt, go without.

listeria lives for a very short amount of time – under 45 days – if a cheese is not pasteurized, but has been aged longer than 45 days – it is a safe bet that all is well.

having said that, when in doubt go without has been my mantra. i was up almost two days at 18 weeks into pregnancy worrying about a specific goat cheese. pregnant women have enough mood changes from hormones – so might consider doing whatever is all possible to have restful nights of sleep and as little anxiety as possible.

my husband has promised me sushi first thing – post delivery – followed by rations of various salumi: prosciutto, bresaola, coppa, salami toscano, etc. and then a cheese course! this will be welcome – but I’m looking forward to a few more months down the line when i can drink wine to my heart’s content!

It’s a bit scary that my post is near the top in google.ie for “goat’s cheese and pregnancy”.

For the UK, I found this page from the University of Sheffield.
http://www.shef.ac.uk/pregnancy_nutrition/nutrition.php?nutrition_id=4.1

which links to these pages regarding listeria and cheeses safe to eat
http://www.shef.ac.uk/pregnancy_nutrition/nutrition.php?nutrition_id=4.2
http://www.shef.ac.uk/pregnancy_nutrition/nutrition.php?kf_id=v

In the US, the FDA also posts the following health information regarding pregnancy.
http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~pregnant/pregnant.html

points to this page re: listeria
http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~pregnant/whillist.html

http://www.babycentre.co.uk/pregnancy/nutrition/foodsafety/cheeseexpert/?_requestid=3634587

Which cheeses are safe to eat when you’re pregnant, and which aren’t?

Anna McGrail answers:
…Pregnant women are advised not to eat soft, mould-ripened cheeses, such as brie or camembert, and blue-veined cheeses, such as danish blue and stilton.

However, thorough cooking should kill any listeria, so it should be safe to eat food containing soft mould-ripened or blue-veined cheeses, provided the food has been properly cooked and is piping hot all the way through.

In healthy adults, infection with listeria can cause a short-lived flu-like illness. Pregnant women, however, can be hit harder by listeria, for the same reason you are more susceptible to everything during pregnancy: your immune system isn’t working as well. Symptoms usually develop several weeks after exposure to the bacteria, which can make it hard to pinpoint exactly which food made you sick. Symptoms may include fever, chills, muscle aches and back pain. Doctors diagnose listeria infection by swabbing a sample from your vagina and cervix and checking your blood. Antibiotics will treat the infection. Newborns can also be tested and treated.

Listeria infection in pregnant women is very rare in the UK, only affecting one in 20,000 pregnancies. Provided you avoid foods with a high risk, you are very unlikely to be affected.

Unpasteurised cheeses imported from abroad or made by small producers are also safe to eat in pregnancy provided they are made from cow’s milk and are not mould-ripened or blue-veined. The Food Standards Agency states that listeria is present in these cheeses in very low numbers and they are therefore not considered a risk during pregnancy. On the other hand, unpasteurised milk (from any animal) is not considered safe. In the USA, pregnant women are advised to avoid feta cheese because of the risk of listeria, but the feta cheese sold in the UK is considered safe to eat during pregnancy.

Cheeses which are SAFE to eat in pregnancy

Hard cheeses:
austrian smoked, Babybel, caerphilly, cheddar, cheshire, derby, double gloucester, edam, emmental, english goat’s cheddar, feta (if bought in the UK), gouda, gruyere, halloumi, havarti, jarlsberg, lancashire, mozzarella, orkney, paneer, parmesan, pecorino (hard), provolone, red leicester.

Soft and processed cheeses:
Boursin, cottage cheese, cheese spread, cream cheese, mascarpone, philadelphia, quark, ricotta.

Yoghurts, fromage frais, soured cream and creme fraiche — any variety, including natural, flavoured and biologically active — are all safe to eat.

Cheeses to AVOID in pregnancy

Mould-ripened soft cheeses:
brie, blue brie, cambozola, camembert, chaumes, pont L’eveque, prince jean, tallegio. vacherin-fribourgeois, weichkaese.

Blue-veined cheeses:
bavarian blue, bergader, bleu d’Auvergne, blue shropshire, cabrales, Danish blue, dolcelatte, doppelrhamstuge, eldel pilz, gorgonzola, manchego, romano, roncal, roquefort, stilton, tommes, wensleydale (blue).

Soft unpasteurised goat and sheep’s cheeses:
chabichou, pyramide, torta del cesar.

Here is the link. I’m not entirely sure how many different food types she is suggesting are avoided.

I knew certain smoked fish and meat were out because you effectively eat them raw (smoked salmon, certain hams etc.) but I was surprised about smoked haddock because it is smoked, but then cooked.

I shall question my midwife next Tuesday.

I’m not vegetarian, but don’t eat any meat at all and very little fish so cheese is a staple part of my diet so I need to find out exactly which ones I can still indulge in!

But are there not nitrates in rashers and bacon in general due to Potassium Nitrate or is saltpetre not used any more?

Actually, re-reading your quote, she is against preserved food in general so all bacon, salami etc etc is out?

“you should avoid some smoked cheeses. Smoked cheese, along with other smoked and preserved food such as meat and fish, contain the active agent nitrate. This can react with the haemoglobin in your blood and reduce its oxygen-carrying capacity.”

So which smoked cheese in particualr should I be avoiding? It’s bad enough not being able to eat brie without smoked haddock and smoked cheese being taken away from me too!